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  • So — Doctor Who: The Live Escape Game. It's now open, as I understand it (and if I got it wrong someone please correct me, and be my guest at deleting all mentions of this specific story from this thread, especially as I am saving the text just in case).

    What do we do about it? Because the thing is, there's never really been anything like it in Doctor Who before. The closest was the interactive story (or, as it were, stories) at the Doctor Who Experience, but that's not quite it either, since the interactive story there was a sort of bonus show to tie together what was already an exhibition in its own right; and indeed, we have separate page for Doctor Who Experience itself and the interactive story within; whereas here the interactive story is all there is.

    My instinct is, first and foremost, that it shouldn't be valid; I've got two different potential rationales, too. The first is that it's basically "a stage-play of which you are the hero", where you are invited to play the companions live and as improv; as such it should be disqualified as a stage play. The second way to look at it is that it's more of a real-life video game, a story where part of the fun is that you get to choose what is done by the characters and in what order. Either way, it's out.

    It is secondly that it seems plenty narrative enough to cover it as a story, albeit an invalid one; complete with pages about Alastair Montague and ChronosCorp[1], with requisite {{Invalid}} tags.

    It is thirdly that since the interactive story is all there is, we shouldn't let the Doctor Who Experience precedent confuse us, and instead create just the one page about the story, just like we don't have separate pages about a video game per se (gameplay and all) and about its plot.

    It is fourthly that holy Rassilon who art in the Matrix, how do we dab this thing? It's this unique beast of a new story format we've never really encountered before.[2] Is it a "(game)"? A "(live show)"? An "(interactive story)"? Heck, could we just cut the Gordian knot and call it an "(escape game)" or "(escape room)", no matter how thin the chances there'll be another one in the near future?[3]

    Notes & References

    1. Before anyone asks, no, it's clearly not the same thing as Chronos Corporation.
    2. The DWE stories were mostly film, and so could be watched as fourth-wall-breaking TV stories if you squinted; though as I type this I notice that Doctor Who Experience Interactive Story (Eleventh Doctor) and Doctor Who Experience Interactive Story (Twelfth Doctor) are not in fact conventionally dabbed, though that may be more to do with the need to distinguish between the two Doctors' versions than a positive desire not to call it a TV story.
    3. Though then again, a guy can hope…
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    • Just gonna put the link to the page as it is already in existence...

      The Live Escape Game (video game)

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    • Aaah, there it is.

      …Yeah, no, "(video game)" really isn't right.

      (Also, is "The Live Escape Game" really this thing's whole title? I think this is one of those cases where Doctor Who is a pretty essential part of the title, not just a reminder of what franchise it belongs to.)

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    • The Live Escape Game is what it says right below the Doctor Who logo. Also, as with other games, Doctor Who is not used in the article titles.

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    • I get why you'd call it that; usual policy points towards it. But this isn't like, say, Legacy, which indeed shouldn't be titled Doctor Who legacy. "The Live Escape Game" isn't a title, it's a description of what this story called Doctor Who is, so that you don't confuse it with other things called Doctor Who.

      It's like… take a theoretical video-game franchise, I dunno, Kingdom Hearts. They make a movie about it, marketed as Kingdom Hearts: The Movie. You may argue that its title is Kingdom Hearts: The Movie, rather than Kingdom Hearts. But it would be goddamn insane to act like its title is The Movie.

      This is a minor point, though, anyway. Any thoughts on the bigger issues I raise in the OP?

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    • It would be nice to hear (in the near future) from someone who’s actually been to one of these. Failing that, a little more research would do us good.

      I don’t think there’s a question about validity: we didn’t even let Attack of the Graske in, which of course would have been far simpler, with more limited choices. Barring a surprise statement about canonicity, like we got with the Adventure Games, I don't see how this could pass T:VALID. Unless there's a complete story independent of the participants' actions.

      The real discussion here is how to cover this thing. And at least speaking for myself, I feel I'm lacking some information. The trailer shows some of the video elements. How do they slot into the live experience? I might just be clueless on this as I've never been to an escape room.

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    • Scrooge MacDuck wrote: Is "The Live Escape Game" really this thing's whole title?

      Its full name seems to be The Live Escape Game: Worlds Collide.

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    • Although I should point out its actual name should be discussed on the talk page rather than here. This is a place to determine dab terms etc..

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    • I'm actually 90% sure the proper title is Worlds Collide.

      For reference, see this comparable poster for a different property: https://escapehunt.com/uk/bristol/games/blackbeards-treasure/

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    • Neither have I. I just created the page so that we have it before it gets so old that we no longer remember it and are unable to find out anymore. Months ago I created question in the Board Index and a link to an article talking about this game, but it's been lost in time.

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    • Sorry, that link does not contain the right image. Scroll to the bottom here: https://escapehunt.com/uk/bristol/games/worlds-collide/

      EDIT: In each poster, the proper name is in big letters in the bottom half, following this format: "Blackbeard's Treasure: An Escape Hunt Original Game". It would follow that the big text above Escape Hunt Original Game in the Doctor Who poster also indicates the title.

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    • Thanks for recovering it at least. I had no idea where it was...

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    • Okay. Sure. “Worlds Collide”. Not a bad title, either.

      So, anyway?

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    • Wait. Not the same link as I found months ago.

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    • As for dab term, there seem to be three major options:

      1. No dab. We treat this topic like an event or exhibition with story elements, rather than a story with live elements.
      2. We decide that an existing dab term fits this perfectly well. I don't really think this is a video game or a stage play, but this is potentially an option.
      3. As this is new territory, we go for a brand new dab term, (escape game), and treat it as an invalid story akin to a (live) video game.

      Just as a note, Dr. Who and the Daleks has no dab term, despite definitely being a story, because it does not fit into any established dab terms and it's not valid anyway. But I should note there is a rename tag there right now, and a comic story adaptation to potentially conflict with.

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    • SOTO wrote: But I should note there is a rename tag there right now, and a comic story adaptation to potentially conflict with.

      Yeah — indeed, you'll find me on that thing's talk page arguing for its dabbing. In its case, there's also the fact that sooner or later we will most likely get another, very-possibly valid theatrical film out of Doctor Who, so we might as well create the dab term now — an argument which applies less to Worlds Collide, as I don't know how likely another escape-game is. Though who knows, really, if this one proves successful.

      But if it wasn't clear yet, of SOTO's three options, I support #3, would be okay with #2, and find #1 a real disservice to Worlds Collide and to escape-games in general as a medium.

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    • Well if we're treating this as a story, there is the question of whether we want to use the premiere variable as with a stage play, or port opening date and other such variables over from {{Infobox Event or Exhibition}}.

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    • Good point. "opening date" would probably be best, indeed.

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    • I thought of a fourth option:

      • All games with a tactile, physical interactive element (ie. anything that isn't a video game) could be deemed simply a (game) in T:DAB TERM. In this option, the same dab term applied here would also apply to board games or card games (where disambiguation is necessary).
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    • Clever. One obstacle is that some games will be narrative and some won't be — a card-game with Who-themed versions of the face cards would be a "(game)" in this scheme, would it not, just as well as something like Worlds Collide? And it doesn't sit right with me to dump a piece of merchandise and a story (albeit invalid) in one category. But there are probably workarounds.

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    • Well if we decide against using (game) as a common dab term, it'd probably be best to standardise card games and board games as (card game) and (board game). Currently it's a bit of a mess, hence the flexibility for our options in terms of this escape story.

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    • What date do we put on the page? I mean, all broadcast episodes, movies and games and so on has a date of release. So what do we put on this page?

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    • Well in full, the opening dates are:

      • Bristol: 16 January 2019
      • Leeds: 25 January 2019
      • Oxford: 8 February 2019
      • Manchester: 22 February 2019
      • Reading: 8 March 2019
      • Birmingham: 22 March 2019
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    • What is "Reading"?

      Also, do we put them all, or just the earliest?

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    • Reading is a town in Berkshire, England. At the moment, only the first opening date applies, as the other locations have not opened yet. But as I said, we would have to bring the applicable parameter over from the event infobox, as {{Infobox Story}} is not currently equipped for this.

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    • Thanks for new knowledge...

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    • Has anyone gathered new knowledge of this escape room since we last discussed this?

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    • I have, actually, though it's secondhand knowledge. A few reviews can be found online by people who have been lucky enough to experience the escape room, such as Mr “Ace Creeper” on YouTube. Our witness Mr Creeper persistently refers to Worlds Collide as a story throughout his review, much as I expected.

      He incidentally gives a few more story details; so apparently, despite what the conjunction of “Worlds Collide” and the presence of Cybermen may have suggested, the narrative has apparently nothing to do with Pete's World or parallel universe; rather, Alastair Montague's company's attempts to build a timeship result in a tear in the fabric of time and space that sees elements of various time-zones crashing into each other, the room depicting the eye of the storm. Among these elements are the much-advertised Cybermen, who it is the player's mission to prevent from fully crossing over into the 21st century. (The Cybermen, as seen in the advertising, are of Mondasian Nightmare in Silver design.)

      At any rate, Mr Creeper says nothing about the player roleplaying as anyone other than "themselves as a DWU character", so we don't even need confirmation of a branching storyline; invalid, most definitely.

      Creeper's not very clear about this but it doesn't seem like the story elements are conveyed only through video, though. A lot seems to be achieved by the props and theming of the room's interior. So treating it as a video story still seems disingenuous.

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    • What about calling it "interactive story"? Also, someone should most definitely check out what information Ace Creeper (and maybe others too) have about this escape room, so we can fill out the page with the appropriate info. (I did similar thing on the The Runaway (video game) page.

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    • Well... now I've found some photos from inside the Escape Room and uploaded them. I'll leave it up to others to decide if we can use them. :)

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    • However as SOTO said, it would be so cool if someone on this Wikia happens to have first-hand experience inside the "game" and can provide some knowledge on what to expect. :P

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    • Hopefully some new information will pop up soon.

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    • Does anyone happen to have gathered some further information about this story? :)

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    • Has anyone managed to gather some more information on this live action escape game? :)

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    • DWM 544 explicitly confirms that the "escape room game" is called simply Worlds Collide.

      I propose either Worlds Collide (escape room game) or Worlds Collide (escape room). Yes, either is a new dab term, but this is an entirely new type of DWU entertainment.

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    • So we ditch the "The Live Escape Game" part entirely? Or do we say that it's an alternative name, as it is what is given on the "poster" itself?

      And yes, I agree with the introduction of a new dab term. As new types of the DWU are born, so must we expect that the existing dab terms simply does not do anymore...

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    • To quote: "DWM has teamed up with Escape Hunt, makers of the interactive Doctor Who escape room game Worlds Collide to provide a discount" . . . "Standard tickets for Worlds Collide are normally £23 per person. . ."

      As far as I can tell, having "Doctor Who: The Live Escape Game" up top is barely different from having "Doctor Who" at the top of the cover for Ravenous 4, or "From the Worlds of Doctor Who: Gallifrey" on the cover for Intervention Earth. Not part of the title, but it highlights the branding.

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    • Furthermore...

      Has someone actually managed to experience it? It would be great if we could get some more info on what to expect inside one of these. :D

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    • I agree that Worlds Collide (escape room game) is best, if that is the way DWM refers to it, although I still think, personally, that escape game is a more elegant term than escape room game.

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    • I've done the Worlds Collide escape room. You get a call from the Thirteenth Doctor who tells you that you have to find certain objects from different periods of time in a lab because of a time experiment or something. It's pretty fun but the story is obviously very slight.

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    • Jack Saxon, there's a plot section on the page. Since you've been there, couldn't you fill it out then? :)

      Also, what references can be found in there?... you know, like in regular stories...

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    • So... what's the deal? What do we do? :)

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    • Now that we have a second escape room "A Dalek Awakens" I believe we really need to do something about this.

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    • I think the (escape game) dab term seems like the best option, given that the page is currently titled "The Live Escape Game". It's also shorter than "escape room game" and has better parallels with the existing (video game) than just "escape room".

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    • Just a reminder that the page is up for renaming to "Worlds Collide", so "The Live Escape Game" is not permanent.

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    • Right. The new pages would be Worlds Collide (escape game) and A Dalek Awakens (escape game). My citation of the current page name was meant to point out that we already have plenty of evidence for the phrase "escape game".

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    • Sounds good to me.

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    • We seem to have arrived at the best solution! Worlds Collide (escape game) and A Dalek Awakens (escape game) will be the titles for these two stories. They will now be categorised under category:Doctor Who games (until a third of their kind arrives, to make "Doctor Who escape games"), as, really, these are not video games at all. They will thus be pulled from any categories and navboxes that suggest they're anything of the sort. And naturally, they remain invalid.

      This dab term, and the presumption of invalidity, should carry forward if ever new Doctor Who escape games arrive on our doorstep. It's an entirely new medium for the DWU, and an exciting one at that. Thanks to everyone who helped work this out!

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