Main image
I have removed the main image posted because it is a publicity photo and not a still from the actual episode. This wiki does not allow the use of promotional images for TV stories I believe, and whether it is a documentary or not is irrelevant. It's still a story originating on TV (thus a TV story), and the main image should and must be from the actual program. Paulisthewalrus ☎ 05:28, November 22, 2013 (UTC)
- First of all, please stop undoing Shambala108's edits to the contrary. This constitutes an edit war — T:NO WARS. Shambala here is also an admin who is far more well-versed in local policy through experience than a relatively new user like yourself.
- Now. To actually answer your question, the main reason we do not allow publicity photos to illustrate stories is that they are not narrative, not-DWU, and are therefore not representative. See T:IUI for more on this.
- In this case, AAISAT is not a DWU story to begin with, so laws against publicity stills do not necessarily apply. Of course, stills taken from the story itself are still preferable, so if you can find that moment or a better one, feel free to post it below so that we can decide on the best possible infobox image. But please return the one that was there until such a decision is made, and do not remove it without discussion.
--SOTO ☎ 05:44, November 22, 2013 (UTC)- First off, your argument that I loose because I'm new and not an admin is both disrespectful and wrong. Second, that's not what the policy says. "The plot is a more detailed summary of the story, ideally illustrated with images from the story." It doesn't matter if the story is valid or cannon or whatever word you like using; or if the story is based on a true story of Doctor Who history. The story is still a story. By the same logic you are using, none of the confidential stories are TV stories either, and any image from production can be used for those. Adventure still constitutes being a TV story, weather it was made to fit into our universe or not. The policy still stands and needs to be followed.
- The fact that you guys didn't want to remove possibly the only usable picture on the site from the page was understandable, but now that I have uploaded an even better image you're just being silly. I suggest that we all follow the Tardis Wiki policy and use the better image. Paulisthewalrus ☎ 14:42, November 22, 2013 (UTC)
- Everyone's acting in good faith here, so let's just take a deep breath. Length of time contributing is clearly unimportant to this discussion. This is an unusual situation, so naturally we're all having to think a bit outside the box. Paulisthewalrus' logic is quite correct. It is a TV story, and so a publicity still can't be used here. There's no need for talk page determination of the best infobox image, as SmallerOnTheOutside has requested. As far as I can remember, we've never needed to resort to such a discussion about a TV story in the past, and I can't see why such an approach would be necessary here. I personally disagree that Paulisthewalrus' picture, however, is the very best we can get, largely because it falls foul of T:GTI's admonition to avoid dark images. I get the message that the image is trying to convey — showing a TV image illustrates that it's a story about TV production — but I think we can easily do better. The Cyberman smoking a cigarette at the top of the story seems to neatly convey the same thing. And there are plenty of images of Hartnell on set where we clearly see TV cameras.
czechout ☎ ✍ 18:09: Fri 22 Nov 2013- I've added an image that features the two main characters in a nice two-shot, and one that clearly shows a key light, so that you know you're looking at something from television production. This isn't necessarily the be-all end-all selection: if you have other images, please don't be bashful about changing the infobox. But I think at a minimum, the image must include Hartnell and give some suggestion of him on a television set. A solo Lambert shot, or any shot that excludes Hartnell is not representative of the piece, and should not be used as the infobox image.
czechout ☎ ✍ 20:37: Fri 22 Nov 2013- I didn't mean that this was the best image period, but rather the best uploaded at that time. Cheers.Paulisthewalrus ☎ 21:50, November 22, 2013 (UTC)
- I've added an image that features the two main characters in a nice two-shot, and one that clearly shows a key light, so that you know you're looking at something from television production. This isn't necessarily the be-all end-all selection: if you have other images, please don't be bashful about changing the infobox. But I think at a minimum, the image must include Hartnell and give some suggestion of him on a television set. A solo Lambert shot, or any shot that excludes Hartnell is not representative of the piece, and should not be used as the infobox image.
- Everyone's acting in good faith here, so let's just take a deep breath. Length of time contributing is clearly unimportant to this discussion. This is an unusual situation, so naturally we're all having to think a bit outside the box. Paulisthewalrus' logic is quite correct. It is a TV story, and so a publicity still can't be used here. There's no need for talk page determination of the best infobox image, as SmallerOnTheOutside has requested. As far as I can remember, we've never needed to resort to such a discussion about a TV story in the past, and I can't see why such an approach would be necessary here. I personally disagree that Paulisthewalrus' picture, however, is the very best we can get, largely because it falls foul of T:GTI's admonition to avoid dark images. I get the message that the image is trying to convey — showing a TV image illustrates that it's a story about TV production — but I think we can easily do better. The Cyberman smoking a cigarette at the top of the story seems to neatly convey the same thing. And there are plenty of images of Hartnell on set where we clearly see TV cameras.
- And in my estimation, you were right at that time. But in fairness to other participants to the discussion, this is a tricky case.
czechout ☎ ✍ 02:31: Sat 23 Nov 2013
Proof that someone plays Jackie Lane
Just posting this photo on hear to stop a potential edit war. Adric♥Nyssa∩Talk? 15:30, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- Not sure why there would be one, as the actress playing her was announced in publicity. The film also has unidentified actors playing Purves (in the photo above), Anneke Wills and Michael Craze. I haven't been able to track down their names, so I just listed them as "Unknown" in the cast list. Hopefully someone will be able to track down the names and add them. Also, while we know the real Anneke, plus Jean Marsh, cameo in the "Goodbye Verity" party scene, an interview with Gatiss in the behind-the-scenes featurette aired afterwards strongly suggests other Who veterans are in the crowd as well. Has anyone else been identified? 68.146.70.124talk to me 16:29, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- This image will probably be deleted soon because it violates one of our policies, namely that we don't allow black bars around the edges of images. You might want to consider redoing it, cropping out the black edges. (Image policies can be found at Tardis:Image use policy, Tardis:Guide to images and Help:Image cheat card.) Shambala108 ☎ 16:30, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- I think Adric/Nyssa just posted it for sake of illustration in the talk page. Though I think it would be appropriate to have images from the different photocall scenes added to the article itself, as well as to the applicable actors' pages (i.e. Jackie Lane's page should have a version of this image without the black bars; Anneke Wills should have an image of the actress who plays her, etc.). 68.146.70.124talk to me 16:33, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- I understand that, but when I'm deleting images that violate policy, I don't necessarily scour the wiki to see where they're posted. If Adric/Nyssa uploads a proper image, not only will it not be deleted here, but like you said, it could be posted to an article page at some point. Shambala108 ☎ 16:49, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- I think Adric/Nyssa just posted it for sake of illustration in the talk page. Though I think it would be appropriate to have images from the different photocall scenes added to the article itself, as well as to the applicable actors' pages (i.e. Jackie Lane's page should have a version of this image without the black bars; Anneke Wills should have an image of the actress who plays her, etc.). 68.146.70.124talk to me 16:33, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- This image will probably be deleted soon because it violates one of our policies, namely that we don't allow black bars around the edges of images. You might want to consider redoing it, cropping out the black edges. (Image policies can be found at Tardis:Image use policy, Tardis:Guide to images and Help:Image cheat card.) Shambala108 ☎ 16:30, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
Source needed for removal of uncredited cast members
Please do not remove information if you have not seen the movie. I have reverted Mini-Mitch's removal of Jean Marsh, Anneke Wills cameos and the fact Jackie Lane, Peter Purves, Anneke Wills and Michael Craze are depicted in the film. Apparently he doesn't believe Matt Smith is in it either. Rather than demanding a source to prove they're in there, maybe Mini-Mitch can provide a source to dispute it? Maybe we're all wrong and that was David Tennant? This isn't Wikipedia where if someone say the sky is blue they require sources in triplicate. 68.146.70.124talk to me 16:47, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- This wiki's policy is: All uncredited cast members need sources. It's a basic policy that you can see enforced on many pages. Shambala108 ☎ 16:51, November 23, 2013 (UTC)
- Being depicted as a character in a film is not the same as being an uncredited cast member. Jackie Lane and Michael Craze were portrayed in this film by actors; they are characters in the film. Adding them as "uncredited cast" implies the real Lane and Craze acted in the film; this is not true, and would be difficult given that Craze died long ago. — Rob T Firefly - Δ∇ - 00:58, November 25, 2013 (UTC)
Since this is being treated like any other television story, I am moving the uncredited cast here until they can be properly sourced. Shambala108 ☎ 20:07, August 13, 2014 (UTC)
- The Doctor - William Hartnell (archive footage)
- Himself/The Doctor - Matt Smith
- Party guest - Jean Marsh
- Party guest - Anneke Wills
- Maureen O'Brien - Anna-Lisa Drew
- Jackie Lane - Sophie Holt
- Michael Craze - Robin Varley
- Brian Hodgson - Joseph Railton
- Christopher Barry - Stewart James Barham
- Production office secretary - Pippa Rathborne
- 1960's vintage mum - Elaine Andrews
- Party girl - Harriet Kershaw
- Peter Purves - Edmund C Short
Article Page Name
Shouldn't this page be called "An Adventure in Space and Time (Docudrama)" instead of "An Adventure in Space and Time (TV story)"? I think it makes more sense but it's just a thought. --TheOriginalDoctor ☎ 20:52, October 14, 2016 (UTC)
- That is currently not one of the dab terms we use on the wiki. We try to keep to a small number of dab terms to avoid confusion. Shambala108 ☎ 00:54, October 15, 2016 (UTC)
William Hartnell link
Surely the page should link to the AAIS&T Hartnell considering "William Hartnell (An Adventure in Space and Time)" is already a page on the wiki --W Mumford ☎ 14:24, October 23, 2017 (UTC)
- Ordinarily, you would be right as the link was more precise. In this case, however, that other page was completely unnecessary and has been deleted. There is no reason to create a separate page for each theatrical/movie representation of a real-world person we encounter in documentaries. All the info about real-world depictions of a real-world person can safely be put on the (real-world) page of the said person. Amorkuz ☎ 21:33, October 23, 2017 (UTC)