Howling:The Doctor And River What Next?

Well this is kinda a sensitive thing but if the Doctor and River are married then surly they have to consummate there marriage (i said it was sensitive) which could mean the creation of a human-galifrayen time lord which i think might get complicated but still if they do not consummate there marriage then it is technically not valid ( i think they will because of rivers comment in impossible astronught) now this will cause the show to become more interesting in my opinion but it may fall in to the generic plot of the child becoming a antagonist... which would be a bit same old but still what i am very interested about is will there be things that happen during the birth on "beginning" of the child which could make for a very interesting plot and character some of you may pick up that i mean it beginning in the TARDIS in mid flight which could mean for a very interesting being for example time lord.2 or something along those lines (possibly time king but than sounds odd) tell me what you think about the topic and my little idea.

Happy Whooing

Whooligist talk to me 16:32, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * I think that we can probably take it as a given that the Doctor and River will consumate their marriage, if they haven't already. Given the way that River's entire story arc has gone so far though, I would think that we would have already seen their child if they were going to have one together. Maybe the Rani is their daughter(that was a joke). It is probably more likely that any child of theirs would be conceived in River's cell at Stormcage then in the TARDIS while it is in flight, because I think after what happenned the last time the Doctor would have the sense to land the TARDIS before having sex with River. Even if they do conveive a child while in the TARDIS while it is in flight, it probably wouldn't matter much unless Madame Kovarian or someone kidnapped and experimented on it. Melody would have been a relatively normal human girl if Kovarian hadn't messed with her DNA. Being conceived in the TARDIS is just what made Kovarian's experiments possible. Icecreamdif talk to me 20:02, May 2, 2012 (UTC)

I've suggested elsewhere that Doctor Kent in The Wedding of River Song was their daughter. Now I'm going to suggest the character to be be played by Jenna-Louise Coleman. Why, after all, were we shown the Gallifreyan character on the Doctor's crib in A Good Man Goes to War? When River said of it "I haven't seen that for a long time," what were the circumstances under which she had seen it before? When the Fourth Doctor said of Romana "You're a good-looking woman, probably?" what was the cause of that?

Yes, I know. I'm a sick B*****d.Boblipton talk to me 21:36, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, River might have been referring to seeing the cot as a baby, although it would seem unlikely that she would remember that. Hopefully the cot is something that will be picked up on again, and hopefully the Gallifreyan symbol on it will be shown to have some kind of meaning. Do you have any reason to suggest that Dr. Kent is the Doctor and River's daughter, or is that just a random guess? Jenna-Louise Coleman might be the Doctor and River's daughter, since Moffat said that "Who she's playing, how the Doctor meets her, and even where he finds her, are all part of one of the biggest mysteries the Time Lord ever encounters. Even by the Doctor's standards, this isn't your usual boy meets girl." Of course, Moffat might decide to move away from every one of the Doctor's companions being related to him and River, but we'll see. If she is the Doctor's daughter, then that opens up the question of what she was doing for the first 20-something years of her life(possibly more with regeneration.) After all, River could hardly have raised her in prison, and I can't really see a later version of the Doctor travelling around through space and time with a baby. I guess she could have been born after River got her pardon in Flesh and Stone, or she could have also been kidnapped by Kovarian, which would seem kind of repetitive.Icecreamdif talk to me 22:44, May 2, 2012 (UTC)

Think silly. 1: How did the photographs in the orphanage (including one of Amy and an infant) show up there? 2: Melody regenerated about January of 1970 in New York. We next see her in Leadworth some time after Easter of 1996 as "Mels". Other people have complained of that gap as a problem. I see it as an opportunity, particularly if you throw in time travel.Boblipton talk to me 23:40, May 2, 2012 (UTC)

the idea i had of the TARDIS thingy was just me wondering if it could be possible i doubt the new companion will be his daughter it would be hard to fit in although if they do have a child i hope it is before Amy and Rorys departure/possible death it just would not be fair on the kid or on amy and rory.

Happy Whooing

P.S. Person who made last comment plase sign it thank you Whooligist talk to me 23:06, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * I always just assumed that the pictures of Amy with the infant were of her with Melody at Demon's Run. The time between 1970 and 1996 is certainly a bit of a mystery. It remains to be seen if that was just an oversight on Moffat's part, if he decided to just let the audience draw their own conclusions, or if there will be future stories that show how the young Mels got to 1996. Presumably the Silence just found her eventually and brought her to the future in one of their TARDIS-like-machines. Either way, I don't really see what any of that has to do with a possible child of the Doctor and River.Icecreamdif talk to me 00:30, May 3, 2012 (UTC)

I've offered you twenty-six years of on-earth time and all of space and time, but you can't come up with a scenario involving these elements? Very well: a later version of the Doctor (perhaps the eleventh during his "farewell tour", finds Melody, as he promised her parents he would "on his life." He proceeds to rear her or arranges for her rearing (see Miranda Dawkins). As she achieves young womanhood, she falls in love with her guardian and they have a child, who spends time in the Doctor's cot. The child is the Jenna-Louise Coleman character.  River is then captured by the Silence, brainwashed, forced to regenerate into Mels and dropped off in Leadworth.

That's one scenario. However, notice that in The Impossible Astronaut (TV story), River is nauseated, just as Amy is. Assume they are both morning sickness. Come up with a different scenario -- or simply continue the scenario I've offered. There's no reason they can't have a hundred children in all of space and time.Boblipton talk to me 01:33, May 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, Mels didn't really seem to know the Doctor personally in Let's Kill Hitler, so it's unlikely that they met before that. Besides, she would have been too young before she moved to Leadworth. Amy suggested that her feeling nauseous was just an effect of the Silence, and as there were Silence in the area when River felt sick, it is possible that that is why she felt sick. Of course, it is possible that she was pregnant. If she is pregnant at any point though, it would probably be at some point after The Wedding of River Song in her timeline. However, if the two did have a kid, we have to wonder who is raising the kid. It would be difficult for River to raise a child until after Flesh and Stone, because she was in jail before that, and the Doctor can't raise her unless Moffat wants the next companion to be an infant. If Jenna-Louise Coleman's character is the Doctor and River's daughter, then it would seem that her story will play out similarly to River's story, and we will see her life in the wrong order. However, since we haven't seen her yet with either the Doctor or River, that suggests that they wouldn't be the ones to raise her.Icecreamdif talk to me 01:54, May 3, 2012 (UTC)

River didn't seem to know Amy in The Time of Angels either or recognize who was in the spacesuit at Lake Silencio. As for being too young before moving to Leadworth, if she was about 5 in 1970, she would have been in her early 30s when she went to Leadworth and I hear the Doctor has a time machine. He claims to have spent two hundred years between The God Complex and The Impossible Astronaut. Assuming that he is a) aware exactly how much time has passed and b) is not lying, he could have spent a century with River before dropping her off for the Silence to grab... assuming that he didn't do it later ... and still have gone down to the end of town and been back in time for tea. That gives him plenty of time to knit booties for the children, make cheese and save the occasional planet. He's got plenty of people to watch the children for him. Nyssa would make a fine foster mother.

Instead of coming up with reasons why a particular scenario won't work, think of how to make one work, given access to all of space time, centuries of practice in lying and a blue box that is as much bigger on the inside than the outside as he wants it to be. Plus a universeful of markers.Boblipton talk to me 02:16, May 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * Well, it would probably be irresponsible of the Doctor to leave his child with a bunch of space-lepers, but I guess he has got plenty of companions who can look after children for him. Maybe Peri and Yrcanos would be good foster parents. The problem is that the Doctor would look like a bit of a jerk if he just left his kids with somebody else to raise them unless he had a good reason for not looking after kids himself. I'm a little bit confused about the scenario that you are suggesting. Are you saying that Mels could have given birth to children in between Day of the Moon and Let's Kill Hitler? The problem is that we saw her as a kid in 1970, and we saw her as a kid in the late 1990s, so clearly she wasn't old enough to be a mother. The other problem is that Mels and River really didn't seem to know the Doctor in Let's Kill Hitler. In Time of Angels, River just sort of ignored Amy introducing herslef, and in The Impossible Astronaut/Day of the Moon she pretended not to know who was in the space suit, but in Let's Kill Hitler she just didn't know anything. She ddin't know who River Song was for one thing, she didn't expect to fall in love with the Doctor, she didn't know what "spoilers" meant, and she had no good reason to pretend not to know these things. If the Doctor and River do hav a child then it will really hav to be after The Wedding of River Song. The most likely way for her to not be raised by her parents would be either a kidnapping, or a similar time travel mishap to The Eleventh Hour, with the Doctor being a few years late to pick up his daughter.Icecreamdif talk to me 03:33, May 3, 2012 (UTC)

imagine this situation: the doctor and river, ahem, dance after their wedding and river gets pregnant. river doesn't tell the doctor, but considering that prison/travelling with the doctor wouldn't be very safe places to bring up a child, once the child is born river puts her in an orphanage. now, aprox. 20 years latter, the doctor meets this wonderful female and makes her his companion. they go on many adventures through space and time. then, at the end of the series, it is revealed by chance that the girl is in fact the daughter of the doctor and river. what do you think? could it work? Imamadmad ☎  06:15, August 17, 2012 (UTC)

It could certainly be made to work, if written & played well enough. Probably, though, it'd be a good idea to leave it for a few years. We don't want to overdo the "companion with a mysterious past/concealed identity" thing. It could be done again but needs a rest just now. --2.101.51.177talk to me 16:04, August 18, 2012 (UTC)


 * Yes, that could be made to work, but it would be hard to have the Doctor put his child in an orphanage without looking like a jerk. After all, the man's over a millennium old. Surely he could settle down and stay on Earth or someplace for a couple of decades until his child is old enough to travel through space and time with him. Maybe, since Amy and Rory are leaving anyway, the Doctor and River will let them raise their kid. That could work since they would be the grandparents, and they missed the opportunity to raise their own daughter.Icecreamdif ☎  19:49, August 19, 2012 (UTC)

i would have thought river might have put the child in an orphanage without the doctor's knowledge because she knew how dangerous it would be to bring up the child themselves and how the doctor would object if he knew. also, can you think of what a timey wimey childhood the child would have if it grew up with parents who aren't even meting in the same order? anyway, i guess it would be nice if they gave the child to amy and rory since they didn't get to bring up melody. Imamadmad ☎  12:54, August 20, 2012 (UTC)

River (Melody) herself was put into an orphanage by the Silence & spent her time trying to escape. She's not going to be keen to put her own child into an orphanage. In any case, "child in orphanage" is a bit too much like what's already been done, unless the similarities were made an important plot point -- River unknowingly acting on a buried command from the Silence, perhaps. Even so, it would risk seeming like "the same old same old". --89.241.66.191talk to me 14:47, August 20, 2012 (UTC)