User:SOTO/Forum Archive/Inclusion debates/@comment-5253713-20150518174430/@comment-10983683-20150518204227

Master of Spiders wrote: The Big Finish Productions Bernice audios and books exist in a totally separate licence to their Doctor Who Audio ranges. The bernice stories were not legally allowed to use the Doctor, Time Lords, TARDISes etc. Thus, it must be asked exactly who are Irving Braxiatel's people who keep getting mentioned, and are influenetial in numerous stories? What exactly is that "time space machine" that Braxatiel travels in? When Bernice meets Iris Wildthyme and they both mention that they have travelled with the same time-traveller, who was it? It can't be the Doctor, can it, because the Bernice audios couldn't legally use or mention him.

And who are those creatures from Mars in the Benny novels and audios? The way they are described, the way they behave, even what they sound like on the audios, one could be forgiven for thinking they are Ice Warriors. Yet, the Bernice stories never acquired the legal rights for the Ice Warriors. Note how in the officially licensed audio Red Dawn (audio story), the term "ice Warriors" can and is used frequently.

It's plainly not true that the Big Finish Bernice stories couldn't use the Doctor.

When Bernice met Iris in The Plague Herds of Excelis, Big Finish already had the rights to the Doctor, and that was the fourth part of a saga featuring Five, Six, and Seven. Audios like The Dance of the Dead called the Ice Warriors "Martians" because, as established in Legacy, that's what they're known as in Bernice's time. The publisher's summary calls them Ice Warriors. Benny's Story and Many Happy Returns both feature the Doctor and multiple references to the BFBS. In its current form, the BFBS even has the Doctor in it, but Benny is still in the lead: "featuring the adventures of archaeologist Bernice Summerfield and her friends the Doctor and Ace!"

Since 1999, the BFBS has had no reason to dance around references to the Doctor, because Big Finish had the rights. There is no doubt the audio series is in the Doctor Who universe. I don't think the argument is strong enough to exclude the Virgin novel series either.