Forum:Full summaries for novels, audio, etc?

Hello, I was wondering if there was a reason there are no full summaries for novels, audios, etc.? All that is given is the publisher's summary, rather than a complete summary that is given for TV stories and comic strips. Glimmer721 21:39, September 18, 2011 (UTC)

Since Glimmer721 brought it up, I'm going to hijack this thread to complain about the mislabelling of the various sectors. 'Synopsis' seems to mean 'teaser' here, 'plot' means 'summary' and 'Personality' frequenttly is 'Actions.' You want to see a synopsis? Take a look at the short squibs in old TV GUIDES or the twelve or fourteen word summary that the NEW YORK TIMES puts in their tv listings of movies. Boblipton 21:48, September 18, 2011 (UTC)


 * Good point. I think if the "publisher's summary" is going to stay, it should just be like the "synopsis" on the TV story articles, followed by the full "plot". Glimmer721 00:22, September 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * I suspect it's just because nobody's written them.


 * If you look at the first NA, Timewyrm: Genesys, it's got a Plot section with the Preface filled in, but the rest of the book missing. Most of the next few NAs have a Plot section that just says "to be added". Most of the later NAs and other novels just don't have the section at all.


 * One easy way to get these started: What's the copyright/license on The Doctor Who Reference Guide? Even if it's not compatible with this wiki, can't we contact Dominique Boles and get permission (and find out how to contact the people who submitted various synopses there)? I don't know that we want to directly import their "Synopsis" section as our "Plot" section and let people hack on it, but someone looking to add a Plot section could wikify and edit one of these synopses much more quickly than writing something from scratch, if that's permissible.


 * Meanwhile, whether we can import text or have to start from scratch, I think the best thing to do is have some volunteer (I'm looking at Glimmer721 here) pick one article and do it, then let everyone else nitpick at it for a while, then present it as a prototype to be used for everyone else to start adding plots. I'd suggest Human Nature as a good first one because it's among the most popular, it's available as a free PDF (which makes searching, bookmarking, etc. a lot easier), and a lot of people re-read it in the last 4 years.


 * As for Boblipton's points: I don't see a problem with calling the plot summary "plot" instead of "summary". As for the others, I don't think it's a problem with the headings, but with the content. If you look at most of the classic stories (e.g., The Invasion of Time), the synopses really are synopses (more than 12-14 words, but I think the length is about right); the problem with recent stories is that people have been writing synopses before the episode airs by combining various website, RT, etc. teasers, and then nobody's rewriting them after the episode airs. Likewise, the "personality" for most classic-series and non-TV characters really does describe their personality, and actions are only given as examples to illustrate personality traits (although occasionally there are a few random actions thrown in, like "Fitz slept with a dark-haired Samantha Jones"). But for more recent characters, the examples have taken over the section. I think in both cases, the answer is to fix the content to match what older articles do, not to change the headings. --70.36.140.19 01:05, September 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * Not to hijack things even further, but… if you look at most of the other sections on novel pages, most of the entries in the Characters, References, etc. sections are very odd. If you compare them to the Whoniverse Discontinuity Guide entries, the reasons become clear: In many cases, someone tried to shoehorn the information from their "continuity" section into our different format. For example, is "Mentions the Ogri" really a fact about The Doctor from Dominion? But I think reworking these is a lower priority than getting plots onto the pages. --70.36.140.19 01:09, September 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * We all have our own priorities. Mine is to fix the language, first into reasonably grammatical English and once it's in a form that I can understand, into something approaching what the writers meant to say, instead of what they actually said. I try to choose the right words, and the wrong word at the top of the section is a sign of the lack of clarity. The last poster seems to think that sheer volume is a good thing. I think that one clear sentence that accurately describes something is better than six thousand words of waffling, poorly stated misinformation. I urge everyone to strive for excellence rather than size, and the way to start is to take those headings and write under them the things that they purport to cover.Boblipton 01:21, September 19, 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think that sheer volume is a good thing, but I do think that some information is better than none; a plot section that says "to be added" is completely useless. And again, I think the problem with the "Synopses" and "Personality" section isn't the heading, but the text: those sections _should_ be synopses of the story and descriptions of the personality, and if they aren't, that's the problem. (And, in fact, the problem with the "Personality" sections usually _is_ sheer volume: as I said, the examples have taken over the section.) Likewise, putting "Mentions the Ogri" into the Doctor's section under "Characters" doesn't mean we should rename "Characters" to something else, it means we should scrap that entry (or move it somewhere more appropriate).


 * Maybe it's better to pick specific examples than to talk in generalities. I think The Invasion of Time has a decent (but not perfect) synopsis, while Let's Kill Hitler has a teaser masquerading as a synopsis, and the solution is to replace that paragraph with a new sentence or two that actually briefly summarizes the plot. If you'd prefer to rename the section to "Teaser" instead, and add one for TIoT, that's also reasonable. --70.36.140.19 01:32, September 19, 2011 (UTC)