Theory talk:Timeline - Ninth Doctor

Placement of Salvation Nine and Last of the Zetacene
As we've now put to bed the placement of Break the Ice with a good source and reference, is there anything to seriously suggest that the entire boxset goes before Auld Lang Syne and not just Break the Ice? Break the Ice is the only 9DA I've not managed to get round to listening to. Do these other two stories get referenced in that one? If not, then surely placing them together where they are currently is nothing more than head-canon? Isn't it more logical to use the rule "release order unless authorial intent states otherwise"? Authorial intent only effects Break the Ice since we hear the Doctor clearly referencing it in the story, and Foley is clearly referencing his adventure with Jack Frost (which also needs updating if I remember). Feel free to shed some light as I'll eventually get around to listening to it, some crazy work weeks atm. I just want what's best and most accurate for these timelines. Thanks to everyone for keeping them alive. <3 The  Farty  Doctor   Talk  15:37, 19 August 2022 (UTC)


 * I haven’t listened to the set, so I admit I can’t say with certainty whether the first two stories reference anything, but considering that isn’t the norm for 9DAs I’m happy to assume they don’t until other evidence is provided. The reason I moved the entire set along with Break the Ice was essentially because I generally prefer to keep the boxsets together if it’s possible. It just feels neater to group boxsets together to me if there’s no reason split them personally. And purely on speculation, I get the feeling that maybe the two latest sets may have been swapped around on the schedule. Purely because it would be strange going from an earth based story in Old Friends, to then a boxset called Back to Earth and then another set called Into the Stars which features a prequel to a story in Back to Earth.


 * There’s no strong evidence either way which I know of, so it comes down to a stylistic choice. I’m personally more in favour of keeping Into the Stars grouped together entirely, but if other people prefer to move the first two episodes to after Back to Earth, then I don’t have major objections. It’s purely just because I think it looks nicer and if people are doing a listen through then they don’t have to listen to the last episode of one set, then do another set and then go back and do the rest of the other set. SarahJaneFan ☎  12:20, 21 August 2022 (UTC)


 * Each story is its own thing and deserves its own analysis. Jack Frost is literally the only thing that's referenced in Auld Lang Syne, and I think it's obvious that's what the tweet refers to. The authorial intent only covers the stories the author wrote, not the entire boxset. It also gets very tempting to put head-canon over objective placements but as some of the only active timeliners here, we need to keep a level head.


 * No references have been made in the first two stories to the Back to Earth boxset. I'm about to listen to the third now. If I can't find evidence that the first two stories take place before Back to Earth, I'll move them back to after only because authorial intent covers only the Jack Frost story. Feel free to ask the authors to elaborate. 148.252.129.98talk to me 10:02, 22 August 2022 (UTC)


 * ^ This is me but on my phone.

After finishing the new set today, I then listened to the behind the scenes, then relistened to Auld Lang Syne. You're right that the mention of having several Christmasses lately is a direct reference to Break the Ice. As you said, it doesn't take place during the adventure, but most definitely before the adventure. Spoiler warning: at the end of the adventure, the Doctor returns Lenni Fisk to Earth and whisks the entire family, including her son, away for Christmas. He promises to show him the "real Santa", probably explaining the "Lapland" reference about 11 minutes into Auld Lang Syne.

However, I just don't think we can place the other two (Salvation Nine and Last of the Zetacene) before it without authorial intent. The stories within the boxset simply don't tie into each other. They're all standalone. Unless someone can dig out any other information from other sources, we simply can't lump them together, even for the sake of making it all look pretty. The onus is on the person making that inference to find the proof before we move them.

Hope this is a satifactory placement. I'm glad I relistened to Auld Lang Syne, though. It was a reference I'd missed the first time around. The Farty  Doctor   Talk  20:27, 22 August 2022 (UTC)