Howling:The Valeyard after The Time of the Doctor

The Valeyard IS coming back to the new series.

One month after The Name of the Doctor (when the Valeyard is mentioned by the GI) the BBC uploaded a video called "The truth about the Valeyard". In the description they assume that the Valeyard is a FUTURE VERSION of the Doctor.

There's also a clearer version of "what is the Valeyard acording to the Master": " The Master claims that the Valeyard is the distillation of the Doctor's darker side, from between the Doctor's twelfth and final incarnations."

We know that the twelfth incarnation is the Meta-Crisis Tenth Doctor who appears to be darker than the 10th Doctor himself. We have already seen the 11th's dark side in Amy's Choice.

Then, going straight to the point, what if the Valeyard is made of the meta-crisis', 11th's and future doctor's dark sides instead of going to appear between his "12th and final incarnations"?

The High Council knew about the Valeyard, so Gallifrey would exists in the future...

What do you guys think?

-- Guagliona ☎  07:03, January 27, 2014 (UTC)

That video was just a clip from Trial of a Time Lord. It didn't offer any new information. For what it's worth, Moffat has said that he never really understood the Valeyard storyline and considers him a dull villain. So I doubt we'll be seeing him again. Personally, I believe he was just one possible future for the Doctor. I don't think any of the glimpses we've seen of the Doctor's future are meant to be set in stone. Trenzalore certainly wasn't. Here's how I see it: The Doctor originally died on Trenzalore, leaving behind the scar tissue we saw in Name of the Doctor. By granting the Doctor a new set of regenerations, the Time Lords changed that future. But the original timeline still exists. Imagine if you will that the Doctor and Clara are traveling on a train and that train is heading towards the Doctor's tomb. The events of Time of the Doctor shift them onto a different set of train tracks. The track they were initially traveling on is still there (which is why Clara was able to enter the Doctor's timeline and everything she did there still happened). It's just that they're traveling on a new track now. I think something similar may have happened with the Valeyard. Maybe the events of Trial convinced the Doctor to take steps that would prevent him from ever becoming the Valeyard. I can't help but wonder if Moffat namechecked him in Series 7 to remind people that if the Doctor knows his own future, he can change it. Slughorn42 ☎  16:38, January 27, 2014 (UTC)


 * The Master says that the Valeyard comes between the Doctor's twelfth and final incarnations. We don't know how he came across that knowledge. He may be misinformed, or he may well have known that the Doctor would reach a forteenth incarnation and beyond. The fact is, we haven't yet seen (we hope!) the Doctor's final incarnation, so there's still a lot of room for the Valeyard to turn up in... assuming that the Doctor hasn't successfully ever avoided becoming him at all86.178.202.150talk to me

Slughorn42, "if the Doctor knows his own future, he can change it": Yes. It's an example of what could be termed a "self-negating prophecy". (At least, it is, if the Doctor does manage to avoid giving rise to the Valeyard.) In any case, whoever wrote the description of that video seems to have misunderstood what was said in Trial of a Time Lord. --89.243.197.97talk to me 07:41, January 28, 2014 (UTC)

I think it's significant to note the specificity of the Master's language in this case "between his twelfth and final incarnations"- "twelfth" now qualifying as either his post-Meta Crisis 10th self, 11th, or 12th Doctor- "final incarnation" now being pushed back an additional 13 regenerations. This means that ANY Doctor from here on out, Capaldi included, could be a candidate for the Valeyard.--anonymoustalk to me 07:41, January 28, 2014 (UTC)

Is it just me or does the actor who plays the Valeyard in that serial looks like Capaldi?