Talk:The Parting of the Ways (TV story)

Uncredited cast
I've moved the uncredited cast to the talk page until they can be properly sourced (not IMDB). Shambala108 ☎  23:23, October 16, 2012 (UTC)
 * Floor Manager - Jenna Russell (uncredited)
 * I applaud — seriously, I really do — your efforts at verification. I wish more editors did this.  Only trouble in this case is that it's obviously Jenna Russell.  She's a fairly famous British actor, having been the female lead in Chris Chibnall's Born and Bred.  Returning to article. This is a case like Bill Nighy being included at Vincent and the Doctor even though he wasn't credited.  We know he's Bill Nighy because he looks, sounds, and acts like Bill Nighy.


 * On a side note, it was kind of a coup to get her in the episode at the time, because she was still filming Born and Bred.  00:37: Tue 18 Dec 2012


 * That's cool, but I've got to say I'm not British and I've never heard of her. That's why I removed her pending citation. There's probably loads more pages where I've done this so I apologize in advance. Shambala108 ☎  03:54, December 18, 2012 (UTC)

Fun Fact (not worth adding though)
This doesn't have to go to the main page, just wanting to point out a fun fact.

In the "Harry Potter"chapter "The Parting of the Ways", the character Barty Crouch Jr. dies. In this "Doctor Who" episode, the Tenth Doctor is seen first time. Both are played by David Tennant.

91.62.229.128talk to me 18:22, December 15, 2015 (UTC)

Continuity section
"It's important that our articles be consistently written from the same point of view. Otherwise, we'd end up with one article written in past tense, another in future tense, and yet another in present tense. Or maybe, some of the articles would be written from a character's perspective rather than the audience's."

- Tardis:In-universe perspective

"When writing the behind-the-scenes section of an in-universe article, write from the point of view that your subject is fictional. There should be an obvious perspective shift from the rest of the article."

- Tardis:Out-of-universe perspective

What is not explicitly stated, indeed, is whether the "Continuity" section should be written from the in-universe or out-of-universe perspective. However, as is clear from the above quotes, it must be written from the same perspective throughout, for all the articles, let alone within the same article. In addition, the shift in perspective from in-universe to out-of-universe parts of the article must be "obvious" and the DWU must be treated as fictional in writing OOU. The second example of right vs. wrong in T:IU explains that even using terms such as DWU in the in-universe parts of the articles is prohibited, let alone names of stories.

Arguing that "Continuity" sections are actually out-of-universe is arguing against an almost universal practice of the wiki. It may not be recorded in policies, but it is very hard to find examples of "Continuity" parts written from the out-of-universe perspective. The "Plot", "References" and "Continuity" sections are all, in the absolute majority of cases, written from the in-universe perspective (albeit in present tense) while "Notes" are explicitly marked at T:FORM TV as containing behind-the-scenes information.

Now to CoT's edit summary "Sometimes a much more concise and accurate statement can be made by going OOU." Actually, a much more concise statement would have been, in this case, Neither CoT nor N8 before him, opted for this simple and much more standard entry. My only guess is that this would not be accurate? Perhaps, not accurate like Or in some other way? If the provided statement is not a hard fact, then, one would think, the readers of the wiki deserve a clarification rather than an obfuscation "It is established". Established by whom? By one of the characters? By the narrator? By N8? By CoT? Established how? By looking? By direct speech? By prior knowledge?
 * "Time Vortex appeared blue while traveling back in time and red while traveling forwards. (PROSE: Lungbarrow)
 * The Doctor's name is Basil. (TV: The Zygon Inversion) ?

If CoT found it appropriate to undo an admin's edit to restore this information to the page instead of engaging in a discussion, as T:NO WARS would suggest, it must be pretty important. In the spirit of T:NO WARS, seeing that CoT has a strong desire to have this information on this page in this form, I am now engaging in a discussion of the information itself. I would appreciate it if CoT could answer two questions: Thank you in advance for your reply. Amorkuz ☎  20:36, November 14, 2017 (UTC)
 * 1) How is this information related to this story, The Parting of the Ways? Why is it crucial to have it in the "Continuity" section of this particular story?
 * 2) Exactly how and by whom was it established in Lungbarrow that "Time Vortex appeared blue while traveling back in time and red while traveling forwards."?

It looks like we have two issues going on: I can't comment on the specific information because I haven't read the novel and haven't seen the tv episode in years, so I won't take a side on this question. Shambala108 ☎  21:15, November 14, 2017 (UTC)
 * How should we write Continuity sections? This is (obviously) a multi-page issue and should really be discussed at Board:The Panopticon. Tardis:Format for television stories is silent on the issue, but at one point (and no, I cannot remember where) I believe it was User:CzechOut who stated that it doesn't matter whether Continuity is written from in-universe or real-world. If this issue goes to the Panopticon, I will do my best to find this information.
 * Whether the information that was removed, then re-added, belongs on this page. Well, let's face it, most of the TV stories and audio stories and a good chunk of prose and comic stories have a lot of entries that aren't really continuity. It could and should be cleaned up, but it's a major undertaking that would require several people who have familiarity with the works in question. Maybe a posting in the Panopticon would help to define what we would like Continuity to contain.


 * I'm not CoT, but I thought I'd give my two cents, since I was the one who actually added the contested paragraph. When I wrote it, it wasn't my intent to write it as out-of-universe, and I'm still not quite seeing what part of it breaks this convention. (And I don't think that convention is nearly as "universal" as you think it is, given that it seems to be broken more often than not on non-TV pages -- see PROSE: Alien Bodies (novel), Lungbarrow (novel), and Beautiful Chaos (novel), for the first examples that jumped to my mind...) Based on your edit summary, I'd think it's my usage of PROSE: Lungbarrow, but I was explicitly trying to match the writing style of other Continuity elements on the page by including that. See:
 * Other attempts at reviving the Dalek race would occur in TV: Doomsday, TV: Daleks in Manhattan / Evolution of the Daleks and Victory of the Daleks.
 * The Daleks have overcome their weakness to bastic bullets, which previously appeared in TV: Revelation of the Daleks in 1984.
 * The Eighth Doctor looked into the vortex in COMIC: The Flood.
 * If the problem was my quoting of the story title -- and now I reread your message, you do specify that story titles are absolutely prohibited in in-universe sections -- why did you remove my section but not all of these? You accuse CoT of having "a strong desire to have this information on this page in this form", and yet based on your own reversion, it seems that you have a strong desire to not have this information on this page in any form.


 * As to why this is relevant here: In PROSE: Lungbarrow, there's a scene where Ace (iirc) rides her bike through the Time Vortex:
 * The engine juddered and the steering jerked against her hands. The tunnel was going faster and wider. It was curving upward. The undefinable golden shapes that always rushed past her on these jumps darkened and were lost. She lifted her hands off the steering and watched the bike making its own adjustments. Thin streaks of light began coursing along the tunnel boundaries. Red to come, blue behind.
 * And that's relevant to this page because, as far as I'm aware, The Parting of the Ways is the first television story to show the TARDIS going forwards and backwards in time, both times with the aforementioned color patterns. If that's wrong, I'd love to know which episode page should have this section. – N8 ☎ 21:19, November 14, 2017 (UTC)