Talk:Tenth Doctor/Archive 2

11 "misses" 10?
Someone edited the end of the Final Travels section to state that Sarah Jane asked the 11th Doctor if he "missed" the 10th Doctor, and that the 11th Doctor paused, implying that he did. I just watched "The Death of the Doctor" again, and at no point does this conversation take place. The only mention of the previous incarnation is that Sarah Jane asks 11 if 10 was okay, if it hurt when he regenerated last time. The 11th Doctor replies "It always hurts". I am going to update this section to remove the non-existing conversation. MrItty 00:06, November 17, 2010 (UTC)

Vale Decem
I understand that the term means "farewell, ten" (Thank you, BTW), but now I am wondering if the section would be better off with an English title, rather than a Latin term. After all, I think most users/readers would be confused by the apparant irrelevance of the title. Does anyone agree? -- Bold  Clone  01:49, December 22, 2010 (UTC)

Like King George being a tyrant, the title will remain "Vale Decem" regardless, so we might as well call it that. Boblipton talk to me 13:55, May 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * Why does it have to remain "Vale Decem", Bob? Seems to me Bold Clone has a good, if belatedly-recognised, point.  It does kinda take a true DW geek to know what "Vale Decem" means.  I mean, the phrase doesn't even make sense in Latin, much less English, unless you're steeped in DW lore.  03:33: Thu 10 May 2012

10/11?
in the stolen earth/journey's end, the doctor is shot by a dalek and regenerates, albeit bypassing the change of personality and appearance by passing much of the energy to his severed hand. but, for the sake of counitng lives, would that not also make david tennant the 11th doctor as well? since the regeneration was technically used up. 78.148.90.94 21:34, April 24, 2011 (UTC)

Infobox missing
Er...what happened to the main infobox template of this page? 2.120.238.201 08:19, November 13, 2011 (UTC)

Very good question. Please put it back at once! Apart from other things, it contains the link to the list of appearances. 2.101.54.208 23:21, November 14, 2011 (UTC)

I put in a new infobox. The list of mentions is incomplete though, so that needs to be redone. Memnarc talk to me 01:24, November 17, 2011 (UTC)

Thanks, Memnarc. Does anyone know if the list of mentions can be recovered from an archive/history? The infobox photo also needs to be retrieved/replaced. Can anyone help with that? 89.241.67.128 17:15, November 18, 2011 (UTC)
 * The infobox has been restored.


 * Basically, all you do is click on "history" in the edit dropdown. Then you comapre the current revision to the one before it.  You keep clicking on "earlier revision" until you find the point at which the damage was done.  Then you go the revision immediately prior to that damage-inducing version, and you choose to edit it.  Then you simply copy the part you're trying to preserve — in this case the infobox — and you go back to the current revision of the page.  Then you paste it into the current page, hit publish, and everything's all healed.


 * In general, it's best to take care of this sort of problem as soon as you see it, because there will be fewer revisions between the current revision and the one that caused the problem. If you're not comfortable working with page histories, I'd suggest looking at help:page history for a decent overview of the function.


 * Finally, if you really don't feel comfortable messing with page histories, that's fine. Leave it to an admin.  But do please alert an admin as soon as you see a major page like this missing an element as basic as its infobox.  A page like a story page or a major character page should always have its infobox visible, so it's a bit of an emergency when it doesn't.  If you don't feel confident fixing the problem yourself, it's a much better practise to directly inform an admin rather than putting a message on the talk page.  23:26: Fri 18 Nov 2011

A possible reason why Regeneration 10 was so destructive
Aside from it being because The Tenth Doctor absorbed so much radiation to save Wilf, His regeneration into The Eleventh Doctor might've ben so massive and destructive because he staved it off for so long whilst visiting his previous companions and, as a result of staving it off for so long, a lot of regenerative pressure could've built up inside The Doctor because he was in need of regeneration as soon as possible and all that pressure was released suddenly when he finally began to regenerate and the sudden release of who knows how much pressure could have made the regeneration so unexpectedly massive and destructive (Destructive to The TARDIS, that is). Just a suggestion, from 94.2.74.123talk to me 21:44, April 15, 2012 (UTC).

Speculative. Boblipton talk to me 13:57, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

Main Image
I know we just did this for the Eleventh Doctor, but I thought it was worth bringing up. While I don't dislike the Tenth Doctor's main image like I did the previous Eleventh Doctor's, I do see a few issues with it. Firstly, when compared to the other Doctors' main images, it's just not as close up on his face. And secondly, the background is almost entirely a motion blur. Personally, I think such an important image should be as blur free as possible. So I've taken the liberty of scouring the Tenth Doctor's episodes for some alternatives.


 * The above one are mine. Out of User:Memnarc, number 1 is the only one I like. The others don't appeal to me. MM/ Want to talk? 09:06, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * Out of User:Mini-mitch's, I like 15 the best. 17 is a good "Tennant" face though. Memnarc talk to me 09:44, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * If we must change the photo, I suggest 8 or 11. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 11:28, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * How far are people going to go with this? Do we do it for all the characters. I had dearly hoped for the Eleventh Doctor to be a one of thing, but since User:Memnarc decided to change the image and then do start a forum discussion, I had upload the images I originally choose when User:CzechOut asked me to add a picture. MM/ Want to talk? 11:34, May 2, 2012 (UTC)


 * I'm only doing what you recommended I do. And I'm sorry again for raising this issue, especially so soon after we went through it with the Eleventh Doctor's image. But it seemed like the Tenth Doctor's image was the odd one out when I was looking through the various Doctors. I just thought it would be best to be consistent in displaying close ups of the Doctor. Memnarc talk to me 00:01, May 3, 2012 (UTC)


 * I like 11, but I can't decide if the brainy specs are frequent enough to show the same way that the psychic paper or sonic is a part of the Tenth Doctor. Otherwise, I'd say 4 or 15 do well in terms of lighting and his expression. -- Tybort (talk page) 13:58, May 2, 2012 (UTC)

Okay, I won't really think any of these are fit for the main image. The only ''reasonably'm good ones are 1 and 11. 1 is out of the question because.... Well... It looks... So unnatural. Just... Weird looking. 11 shouldn't really be used because it has the speaks, but out of these it's definitely the best. (Unless someone wants to argue that his hair is important to his chareactor or something... OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 15:51, May 2, 2012 (UTC)
 * 11. Definitely 11. Not saying there might not be better pics available, but of the ones on this page, 11 is clearly the most T:ICC-compliant.  18:04: Wed 02 May 2012


 * 11 is a good one, but I also like #7 for clarity and brightness. I agree with with OS25 that #1 is weird looking, though I do like the TARDIS console in the background. Shambala108 talk to me 03:09, May 3, 2012 (UTC)

Enthusiasm seems to have waned pretty quickly here. Should we narrow things down a bit with a poll? I don't know how to make one, but there do seem to be some pics which are favored more than others. Memnarc talk to me 03:23, May 8, 2012 (UTC)

Reasons

 * OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 12:29, May 8, 2012 (UTC) 11 is the only good image here.
 * 05:25: Wed 09 May 2012 Agreed.  11 is the only thing in compliance with T:ICC.  More than that, it's actually a pretty cool image.  I love the fact that the brainy specs are on.  I think whoever said upthread that the specs aren't indicative of this Doctor was wrong. He wears them, if only briefly, in almost every adventure. When I think of Ten, I think of specs in exactly the same way that bow ties are evocative of Eleven.
 * By the way, I kinda think that this is sort of an unsatisfactory choice. I'd fully support a whole new round of pics, because there seems to be some general dissatisfaction with the choices.  A choice of one isn't much of a choice. 05:33: Wed 09 May 2012
 * My vote is for #11 but I agree with CzechOut that there has to be a better picture out there somewhere. Shambala108 talk to me 05:43, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

If there's this much dissatisfaction, perhaps we should continue the search. Here are some more.

I'll look for more tomorrow if none of these are favourable. I quite like 21 personally. Memnarc talk to me 10:00, May 9, 2012 (UTC)
 * I would vote, but I have to say that the images that have been narrowed down is wrong. It seems to be bias in favour of 11. There was about 5 or 6 images uggetsed beside 11, and we have to choose between two, one of which was only suggested once. I agree that we should continue to look for images until we find a decent set we can narrow down to. Out of the images above, I do like 21, but woukd dismiss 22 since it's right looking. MM/ Want to talk? 10:12, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

These images are much better. I would still go with 11 if these choices were added, although I also favor 23 I suppose. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 12:33, May 9, 2012 (UTC)


 * I have combined our two galleries OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 14:29, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

Poll
[Poll closed by CzechOut.


 * A new poll, narrowed down to the ones people like and have suggested. MM/ Want to talk? 12:41, May 9, 2012 (UTC)

Okay, so, sTate below which you like and why.


 * OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 14:35, May 9, 2012 (UTC) 11, again


 * -- Tybort (talk page) 15:36, May 9, 2012 (UTC) Still not certain about illustrating using brainy specs he doesn't even NEED according to Time Crash, but I have to say 11. It's a good left-leaner and nicely framed.
 * Just as an aside — how do we know that the Tenth Doctor has returned in The Family of Blood? Because he puts on his brainy specs.  01:08: Thu 10 May 2012

New round of pictures
With apologies to user:Mini-mitch, I've closed the poll he started. We don't need to rush into a new poll, since this Doctor's era won't have new additions in just a few months. Ten is no more, so we can afford to look around a bit more.

And I found that the pics in that poll really didn't grasp the problem that made the first poll fail. This whole discussion started on the basis that the original infobox pic wasn't close enough. It was felt that it would be more T:ICC and T:GTI-compliant if we went for a pic that was a tight shot, as on other Doctors' pages.

Unfortuntely, most of the pics that have been submitted so far haven't been significantly closer than the pic that started this whole debate. So I'm ruling all the pics that aren't at least three-quarter frame closeups out of the running, and I'm adding in some new ones.

If you want to add your pics to this discussion, just add them to the galley. I've taken off the hideaddbutton function in this one case in the hopes of encouraging more to participate. Remember, though, the pics must be ''really tight on the face.

In the meantime, please give your views on only the pictures in this gallery. 01:08: Thu 10 May 2012
 * Much better. Out of the images presented, I think I'd go with either 23. I would also consider 11 and 31. The problem I notice with some of these images is that they look rather dark, but most of these look fine.I wouldn't go with 26 just cause you can barely see his face. Other than those two things, theses all seem fine. OS25 (talk to me, baby.) 03:40, May 10, 2012 (UTC)


 * I like 11, 23, and 34, but if we're not stuck with left-looking only, my vote is for 23. It's very clear, nice and close, the colors are good, and I like the seriousness. Shambala108 talk to me 03:49, May 10, 2012 (UTC)
 * I really liked Memnarc's additions from Silence in the Library, but like OttselSpy25, I couldn't quite figure out why they were so dark. So I went back to my copy and found those scenes noticeably clearer and sharper.  So I've added several pics that are essentially riffs on what Memnarc was doing.


 * The more I think about it, the fact that the Tenth Doctor puts on the glasses in The Family of Blood to indicate that he has returned to John Smith's body makes them rather more essential to his character than has been alleged in this thread so far. I mean, they are there right from The Christmas Invasion. As I've been drug into this debate and have ruminated on the problem more, it's really hard for me to think that the infobox pic should be devoid of the specs.


 * Oh, and just to announce my personal preference, it's 26 at this point, which I think is just damned cool, unusual and beautifully lit. I love the way it's the brown suit, but lit blue, so ya get, sorta, blue and brown suit at once.  That said, the only thing I think is non-negotiable at this point is that specs must be present in the infobox. 13:26: Thu 10 May 2012


 * I am really drawn toward the 34s and number 37. I don't know what I really like them. 31 is really good as well. MM/ Want to talk? 13:37, May 10, 2012 (UTC)


 * Personally, I wouldn't mind most of these images as the infobox pic. The only exceptions really are 26, as it's almost entirely in profile and you can't see his eyes, as well as the brighter images CzechOut supplied, (34b & c, 37), which make the Doctor's skin tone seem unnatural. I'm inclined towards the Silence in the Library pics, particularly 33 and 34, although 38 and 39 are interesting as well. Memnarc talk to me 22:09, May 10, 2012 (UTC)
 * Added 41. Although I know pictures with brainy specs seem to be preferred by most (admittedly, myself included), I thought I'd add this one, partly to remind everyone of the discussion, but also because 41 just seemed so rife with meta-humor. Besides the expression being nice and inquisitive, the two heart shaped lights in the background seemed like a great reference to Time Lords having two hearts, as well as the Tenth Doctor's tendency towards romance. Memnarc talk to me 09:32, June 3, 2012 (UTC)

Let's close 'er up
Wow, this thing still hasn't been settled? Okay, lemme step in and try to bring this thing to closure cause we've been at it for weeks. What I'm seeing is broad support for something in the 34 range. No one has spoken out against the 34s and most people have either specifically supported 34 or implied they'd be good with it. While I note Memnarc's point about "unnatural" skin in 34b, I'm really not seeing that personally. If anything, the straight-up 34 is unnaturally dark — an observation that OttselSpy25 implies as well. Anyway, I suspect Memnarc is comparing the full size pics, and we've got to decide on the basis of which one looks better as a thumbnail. I therefore declare 34b the winner. Unless there's significant objection within the next week, it'll be changed by Monday next, the 11th of June. 03:15: Tue 05 Jun 2012
 * Hearing no objection, this motion is carried and the discussion is closed. Please do not change the infobox picture without again having a similar discussion.  Such discussion may not be initiated for six months from this date.  16:56: Thu 14 Jun 2012