Talk:Cyberon is Back!! (webcast)

Delete/Validity
This is a trailer, not a narrative. It's different then Shadows and that's why I put the delete tag. Never Forget The Day The 456 Arrived ☎  10:57, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * At worst that means this should be invalid, like Ace Returns! (webcast), but not necessarily deleted. That being said, this page was created as valid by an admin, User:OncomingStorm12th, so I suggest you get your facts right. This has emphatically not been termed a trailer by Arcbeatle, who have instead dubbed it an "overture" in the YouTube description. --Scrooge MacDuck ☎  11:00, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * I completely concur Scrooge MacDuck, except I think that this should never be invalid, due to the precedent set by the Tardisode series. Epsilon the Eternal ☎  11:03, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah, brevity in itself is not really reason for invalidity. On top of the great Tardisodes precedent brought by User:Scrooge MacDuck, we have Vrs a (literally) one-sentence story, which has also been created as valid from the beginning. OncomingStorm12th ☎  17:31, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * "Narrative" just means if things happen with sort of the loosest sense of continuity following them. (Fictional reference works are non-narrative in that things aren't happening, they're describing things that ostensibly already happened.) In this trailer/webcast are things happening? Najawin ☎  18:25, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * A Cyberon appears in a dark, wet alley, it turns, and it attacks something off screen.
 * No less narrative than the Tardisodes, Vrs, Untitled, etc. Epsilon the Eternal ☎  18:46, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * Exactly. (Clarification to my prior comment, a fictional reference work is perhaps better understood as describing "the furniture of the world" than just events that already happened.) Najawin ☎  19:07, September 6, 2020 (UTC)
 * If I may play devil's advocate then, why is this valid but say Genetics of the Daleks, which does pretty much the exact same thing as this, not valid? StevieGLiverpool ☎  23:24, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Big Finish explicitly calls it a Promo. Najawin ☎  23:34, 29 October 2022 (UTC)
 * Surely that shouldn't bypass Tardis:Valid sources Rule 1: Only stories count, right? Are there not instances where sources aren't valid simply because they aren't a narrative? As such this also isn't a story, it's just a Cyberon appearing. StevieGLiverpool ☎  01:11, 4 November 2022 (UTC)

Whether or not this particular webcast is narrative is a distinct issue from what is different between this issue and Genetics of the Daleks (webcast). The latter is explicitly called a Promo, and thus runs afoul of our rules against trailers. This is not, so it succeeds or fails based on rule 1 irrespective of the comparison to the other webcast. Why don't we think the arguments on this talk page are successful? Najawin ☎  01:25, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
 * @User:StevieGLiverpool — "narrative" doesn't mean "three-act structure", it just means "depicting in-universe events". Cyberon is Back! is narrative: you can summarise things that happen in it. It's night, then a weirdly hollow Cyberon teleports in, then it slowly gets up from its crouching stance. Taking a step back, The Blue Scream of Death is also very conspicuously a sequel to its events. This isn't a random moving image of a Cyberon, this is a specific incident with a place in the overall lore. And yes, Genetics of the Daleks is narrative too. As User:Najawin explained, the issue is that it's a commercial, and that commercials are deemed to break Rule 4 regardless of whether they pass Rule 1. Scrooge MacDuck ⊕ 09:01, 4 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Fair enough then. I'm convinced it's good enough to keep validity status then!StevieGLiverpool ☎  11:31, 4 November 2022 (UTC)