Talk:Listen (TV story)/Archive 1

Are they the Doctor's parents?
The article currently states the man and the woman in the barn are the Doctor's parents, and many editors have been editing other articles to reflect that. However, there is not actual evidence they are his parents. The actors aren't even credited. How should we make pages for them, Man (Listen) and Woman (Listen)?  P&amp;P  talk   contribs  21:29, September 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * Also, Daniel Joyce and Penelope Gate should be locked for a bit so people don't try to add info from this episode.  P&amp;P  talk   contribs  22:03, September 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * I'd probably say they are the Doctor's parents because they were talking about him like he was their son and saying things you'd only think that only parents would say not any random person. Lewody1 ☎  22:10, September 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * To me, the line about "in the house, with the other boys" suggests it's some kind of boarding school type setup. Anyway, there isn't any definitive evidence they're his parents, so it would be speculative to say they are, and a pretty big leap of logic to say they are Ulysses and Penelope Gate.  P&amp;P  talk   contribs  22:18, September 13, 2014 (UTC)
 * I agree with Picasso and Pringles: What they say suggests they're orphanage staff or boarding school teachers rather than parents. Since we see just their legs and have no evidence at all, they are his parents, I hope these lines get removed or edited. - 87.211.75.45talk to me 22:35, September 13, 2014 (UTC)
 * At the House of Lungbarrow there are many families living there so there sare many other boys living there such As Braxiatel, Almund et al so it is reasonable for them to be his parents. Adric♥Nyssa∩Talk? 22:44, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

Without conclusive evidence you can't edit articles to that effect.-- 22:49, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

The voice of the mother sounded just like Jenny Flint. Were the actors uncredited? --Bisqwit ☎  11:48, September 19, 2014 (UTC)
 * Yes they were. I doubt it was Catrin. We'll probably have to wait for the DWM Special Edition that covers this episode to find out who they were. I'd especially like to know who played the young Doctor.Slughorn42 ☎  15:48, September 19, 2014 (UTC)

Synopsis
The current synopsis is terrible and contains numerous errors. If we could reverse it to the previous synopsis without reversing the whole page, that would be great, as the previous one was really good. The Farty  Doctor   Talk  21:31, September 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * The last synopsis was copied from the BBC. We want original content, so we can't use that one.  P&amp;P  talk   contribs  21:35, September 13, 2014 (UTC)


 * In which case, I'll take at look at what we've got and try to improve it. The  Farty  Doctor   Talk  21:35, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

Young First Doctor
Spoilers for "Listen" but I was stunned and amazed when they had the First Doctor as a child in the ending scene. It made me do research on William Hartnell and I found this photograph of a young William Hartnell so I thought I'd share.

http://www.byrnerobotics.com/forum/uploads/MichaelTodd/2010-05-30_053419_YoungHartnell.jpg

I suppose we could think of it as the Doctor's academy graduation photo.:)

This is also on the howling.

Is there any evidence that this young gallifreyan is the doctor? 37.201.229.150talk to me 22:57, September 13, 2014 (UTC)
 * Of course there is. Clara tells him that he'll return to the same shed during the Time War, which cuts away to a clip of the War Doctor during The Day of the Doctor. That's surely enough proof? The  Farty  Doctor   Talk  22:59, September 13, 2014 (UTC)
 * Not to mention the TARDIS was linked to Clara. No reason it would take her to another Gallifreyan. 23:00, September 13, 2014 (UTC)

Young Doctor or not?
The ending is deliberately left ambiguous to whether it is indeed the young First Doctor that Clara visits at the end. The use of a War Doctor flashback is an indication that Clara believes the Gallifreyan to be the Doctor, not that the Gallifreyan is the Doctor. At no point in the narrative is the Gallifreyan's identity confirmed.

As this is a Steven Moffat-written episode, and Moffat has a history of lying to preserve spoilers, we should take extra care before we officially declare the Gallifreyan's identity. Bwburke94 ~ Creator of All Things Brilliant! ~ 02:10, September 14, 2014 (UTC)
 * No, this is the Doctor. The episode makes that clear because it establishes that the TARDIS is going to places within specific individual's timeframe so there's no point in the TARDIS going to some random Time Lord's barn. Plus the flashback to Day of the Doctor establishes definitively that this is the Doctor as it is an intentional and obvious arrow just as the flashback to the adult Danny was intended to confirm that the kid Clara meets is Danny as a child. There is no debate. This isn't Moffat subterfuge. This isn't even a Captain Jack/Face of Boe scenario. 23skidoo ☎  15:44, September 14, 2014 (UTC)

Callback
Did anyone else notice the callback to the 1st Doctors "One day, i shall come back" speech. Clara tells the young doctor that one day he shall come back to this barn. I think that this should be added to the page if people agree. Also the callback to the day of the doctor, the never cruel or cowardly bit. --Ruairih ☎  11:38, September 14, 2014 (UTC)

Also, “Fear makes companions of us all.” Moffat is calling back to the moment in the Cave of Skulls in 1963 when the first Doctor comforted Barbara with almost those exact same words: “Fear makes companions of all of us.” --Ruairih ☎  11:53, September 14, 2014 (UTC)


 * Yes, you could put that into continuity.-- 12:33, September 14, 2014 (UTC)

"No antagonist"
"It is also one of the few episodes to not feature some kind of antagonist." That's a bit of a spoiler, isn't it? Perhaps it should be changed. 81.111.14.92talk to me 22:53, September 14, 2014 (UTC)


 * This wiki's definition of a spoiler is anything from an unreleased story. Once it's officially aired, its fair game for any article. If you want to avoid spoilers about an episode, you should probably avoid its page.  P&amp;P  talk   contribs  23:31, September 14, 2014 (UTC)

What is the figure under the cover?
We only get a glimpse of the figure when it lifts the cover while standing behind the three protagonists in Rupert's bedroom. But it didn't look human to me... --88.73.69.21talk to me 21:57, September 15, 2014 (UTC)

No "The Promised Land" reference
This is the first episode in season that is not connected to (any) story arc. Isn't it? 188.123.231.21talk to me 18:00, September 16, 2014 (UTC)
 * Without having seen the entire season, we don't know that for sure. Shambala108 ☎  14:11, September 19, 2014 (UTC)

"Listen" to what I have to say.
The main image used for this page gives away the big twist of this episode for anyone who hasn't seen it and thus should be changed to something more appropriate and spoiler free, like a screenshot of the part in the episode where the boy's ankle gets grabbed by an arm from underneath his bed. Kahler Bill ☎  22:58, October 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * You can't expect a page for the episode Listen to not contain spoilers for Listen - that's ridiculous.-- 23:03, October 20, 2014 (UTC)


 * To expand a bit on what Skittles the hog says, the opening paragraph of Tardis:Spoiler policy states,
 * "In order to provide the most accurate and up-to-date information, this wiki contains details about all stories that have been officially broadcast, released or published for the first time, be it in the United Kingdom, Australia, Canada, or the United States. These details would be spoilers to some, but not to this wiki. If a story has been officially released, anywhere in the world, it may be discussed freely anywhere on this site. It's up to you to determine whether you wish to be spoiled about available stories that you personally have not yet experienced."
 * Once a story has been released, any/all info can be included on pages. Otherwise, if we tried to avoid all possible spoilers, we wouldn't have much of a wiki. Shambala108 ☎  23:08, October 20, 2014 (UTC)

The shrouded figure
This... THING... whatever it is... as the article makes reference to it currently, my bolding the key phrases.


 * Clara emerges out from under the bed to find someone sitting on the bed shrouded in the cover.
 * She tries talking to the person but it does not respond. She asks Rupert if it is a friend playing a game but he shakes his head.
 * She asks the person if they are playing a trick on Rupert to which the person stands up.
 * He then asks if the person underneath the cover is scared, to which he self-proclaims "Nah!"
 * The Doctor tells Clara and Rupert to turn their back to the person and look out of the window. :
 * The Doctor postulates that it is either a friend playing a joke on Rupert or it is something else.
 * When Clara asks if there is a plan, he addresses the person under the covers and requests that whoever it is leave in peace.
 * He makes the promise that if the person leaves they will not look.
 * The person moves towards the trio and Rupert turns his head momentarily before the Doctor tells him to turn back around and for all three to close their eyes so as to prove that they will keep to their word and not look.
 * After a moment, the person leaves (taking the cover) and the three turn around.

I would like to know if it would be allowed for us to make a character page for this thing, and if so, if we might mine some specific quotes from the 12th Doctor regarding specifically what he called it, in his own words, to use as a page title. --talk2ty 07:06, December 16, 2014 (UTC)

There's already page for it at Figure (Listen). 07:17, December 16, 2014 (UTC)